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Drewblet |
Oppinions
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 Drewblet |
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 s1creamer |
1. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 2:28 AM EDT
here's what I think, in no particular orderI'm a fan of kurt saxon as well, you might try out james rawles if you get the chance. Read the Niven and Pournelle, book and really like it. I'm not sure how likely it is though. Not the disaster, the response to it. You seem to read a lot, so I'm guessing you're familiar with social contract theory. I'm not arguing that hobbesian morality is right, I'm saying that most people will cooperate out of self interest. As long as a decent percentage, not even a majority sticks up for some rule of law, if just as basic as don't murder, don't rape and don't eat folks, most will tow that line cause they don't want to get murdered raped or eaten. Look at periods of civil unrest, riots get bad and horrible thing happens, but unless there is an outside motivating force, "tribal rivalry" in africa or the mid east, it is mostly just a small percentage that goes totally bad and causes most of the carnage. Armies of vicious thugs just not real likely in my opinion, small groups, you betcha. not sure how helpful that is, just a difference of opinion not a dispute of fact. |
 _Mario_ |
2. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 5:54 AM EDT
Not sure if your theory could work in europe. As to the killer caravns, what happens when they run out of fuel?
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Drewblet |
3. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 12:26 PM EDT
"I'm a fan of kurt saxon as well, you might try out james rawles if you get the chance.Thanks, I'll look rawles up. I do read a lot, and I am familiar with social contract theory. While that *is* true in normal society, let's take a look at the LRA in Uganda. The Lord's Resistance Army was founded by Joseph Koni, who beleived himself to be a prophet of god. Because he was the "Holy Man" and the "Boss," everyone did what he told them to, which lead them to be the scourge of East Africa, second only to AIDS. They killed, maimed, raped, stole, kidnaped, and canabalism is suspected. Fortunately, they hardly ever left Northern Uganda, and have now been disbanded, but there's an example of the social contract being broken and never repaired. And then there's the Nazis, who commited attrocities just because the boss man said they could and should, and encouraged them as they did so. [contd.] |
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Drewblet |
4. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 12:48 PM EDT
[contd.]Have you ever heard of the Milgram Experiment? Go to Youtube and enter in "Milgram Experiment (Derren Brown)" if you want to see it taking place. What basically happens is that a person thinks that there is another person strapped up to a machine. The strapped up person is asked a series of questions, and if they get one wrong, then they supposedly get an electric shock from the machine, which is controlled by the other person. Of course, there's nobody strapped in, they leave when they're out of sight, but the question-asker doesn't know this. The shocks increase in power, until the person that's strapped in starts screaming. Of course, they're either faking, or it's a recording. Eventually, the person stops screaming, appearently dead, all because the authority figure kept telling the question-asker that everything was fine. Now, of course, these three examples I've given apply to bad leadership, but the Nazis soon started to enjoy their jobs at the death camps, and the LRA had a gay ol' time pirating Uganda. One more example, the Irish Republican Army. They were an army of vicious thugs, and they were probably the most effective terrorists ever. Jihadists got nothing on them. By the way, Jihadists, often, are vicous thugs, although a large number are illiterate people listening to misenterpretations of the Q’aran by corrupt clergy. Anyway, one also must consider what people will do out of self-preservation. You get stuck in a trafic jam in a tunnel, and the zombies appear behind you. People are going to be trying to push their way out, steal others' vehicles, steal others' stuff, people will kill each other, and I doubt if even you will stop to help the little blond girl with pigtails and pink pajamas to [contd.] |
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Drewblet |
5. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 12:56 PM EDT
[contd.]to get out of her car so that she can catch up with her parents, who accidentaly left her behind. After having to keep from dieing long enough, and having to do enough nasty things, you tend to turn into a robot, who would gladly go in and pillage a farm, if that's what you had to do to survive. And then you get a bad leader in there, and there goes the neighborhood. I guess it mostly boils down to personal experiance, and leadership. As for their running out of fuel, they'd probably try not to. They'd steal it from others, siphon petrol stations, etc. Although, some people will be stupid enough to get stranded in the middle of nowhere. That was a long response. Wow. Your friend and mine, Drewblet. |
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s1creamer |
6. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 7:33 PM EDT
ok, again gonna debate your opinion not your facts, as they are on the money.The milgram experiment is good stuff, but if I remeber what I've read over it, it was designed to test the limits of an individuals response to authority. All I'm saying is that authority cannot establish itself initially with 'evil' acts. Nobody wants to be a bad guy. Folks are gonna naturally gravitate to those groups that share there preestablished moral values, unless there is outside influences. As far as Nazi's go, I've got to disagree with you. Taken out of context what I'm about to say will seem wildly wrong and politically incorrect so read it carefully and think about it before you decide I'm a racist weirdo. Most of the Nazi's weren't that bad. The majority of the German army joined the Nazi party because it was good for their career, and eventually for their personal safety. The majority of them had no idea what was going on in concentration camps until after the fact. I'm not saying Hitler wasn't evil, and atrocities did not happen. I'm saying that the external factor of Hitler's insanity became evident after his rise to power, not before. Not sure if you're from the US but look at some of the people who were in the German American Bundt in the 20's and 30's, it didn't seem that bad at the time. The Uganda example I don't think applies at all because the level of societal trust in cultures in that part of the world are wildly different than that found in the US, and in most of western Europe. You get that tribal us vs them mindset and its way easier to do horrible things to the them, in the US, you still get random strangers who will stop to help a stranded motorist etc. cont. |
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s1creamer |
7. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 7:40 PM EDT
as far as the IRA, didn't start out as a terrorist organization, although I accept that that is what it is now. It began with a guerilla army fighting for independence. The difference between those original members and the US's founding fathers was the level of success they enjoyed. Although over time, the violence moved from military targets to civilian on both sides, the IRA is a terrorist org now, I don't think its analogous to any organization that could spring up post z-day.All I'm arguing is that for a group of bad guys to reach the kind of critical mass to make that large a group takes some very powerfull outside influences. One of these historically has been an enemy to focus the hate on, whether that enemy has done anything to provoke it or not. I don't think in the face of a zombie outbreak a "bad" yet charismatic leader would be able to harness that kind of strong feeling. |
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Drewblet |
8. RE: Oppinions
May 28 2009, 11:41 PM EDT
Well, a Master's in Philosophy sure as heck impresses me. I'm glad that you don't spout out erroneous facts, like many do. Just the Uganda thing is incorrect; it's one of the two countries in Eastern Africa that actually have superior societal trust to North America or the UK. Trust me, I've lived there.Besides being a racist pig, you're right about the Nazis. They were just like any effective army, except that some of them had to do particularly terrible things. And I'm not saying that they were bad people doing this. In fact, Rudolph Hess, the head of Auschwitz, was a really nice guy. It's just that they were made to do an aweful job, and they reprogrammed their minds to accept it. The reprogramming of the minds is the main issue, here. And I'm Canadian, not American. Yeah, unfortunately, I stereotyped the IRA a bit too much. I'd say that a zombie apocalypse leading to total socioeconomic colapse would count as a powerful outside influence. Back to the Nazis! After the First World War, it was basically an apocalypse in Germany. Being forced to pay for damages, Germany experienced 4,000,000,000 (4 billion) percent inflation, so that a loaf of bread would cost billions. They had an economic collapse, and some people wanted the "socio" part in there, too. I'm about to exceed 2000 characters, so I'll get done. The German people were going through hell, and they wanted somebody who looked like he knew what they were doing to help them to get out of it. Hitler took over the DAP, gave his 21 Points speech, and everyone thought that he was the Barak Obama of Germany. I don't like Obama. He looked good, so they flocked to the Swastika. If a leader pops up during the apocalypse and looks like he's the best choice to follow, he will be followed, almost regardless of his behaviour. *Almost*. |
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s1creamer |
9. RE: Oppinions
May 29 2009, 9:22 AM EDT
My response in no particular order.working on the masters, still don't have it. I concede that I know jack shit about UGanda, I was just assuming based on its geographic location, haven't ever lived there or read a whole lot about it. Mea culpa and whatnot. Out of curiosity what is the other east african country that has a high level of societal trust? If you're interested in a look at why the Nazi's did what they did I recommend a book by Hannah Arendt, spelling? called the banality of evil. She was a mildly famous Jewish reporter who covered the nuremburg trials and then wrote a book about how people could do what was done in the death camps, I don't agree with everything the book says but it made me think so thats a plus for me. Canadians are Americans, or have we still not annexed you guys yet? The more I think about it the more I think your original point had some merit, while most of the examples you listed I see as legitimate authority that went bad in all honesty the events at Waco or the Jim Jones scenario show that authority is sometimes based solely on charisma and not a more "legitimate" for lack of a better term method. I don't know, I've never given much thought as to how proto-societies form, I'll have to give it some consideration before I'll break down and agree with you, but you may have a point. I'm glad I read your profile, its given me something interesting to think about. |
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Drewblet |
10. RE: Oppinions
May 29 2009, 12:26 PM EDT
I know that you're working on the master's, but it still impresses the heck out of me that you would.That's a fair assumption to make about Uganda. Tanzania is the other with a high level societal trust. I'll look that book up; thanks. I'm a bit of a Hitler expert, To the rest of the world, we Canadians are Americans. I have some funny stories. To us Canadians and many of you US-Americans, we're a completely seperate entity. Comedians like to describe us as "America's smarter little brother," seeing as we're always inventing something, but 41% of our country is still officially unexplored. Thank you. Your point has merit, too, it's just that mine is far, far better. ;-) It did take me far too long to find a good way to state it, though. I'm glad you read my profile, too. I enjoyed talking with you. HEY! Maybe you can write your thesis on this. Eh? Eh? Just kidding. And, just so that you don't think I'm some zombie-crazed loonie, I find a WWIII-type scenario, a civil war, or a total socio-economic collapse, which would probably lead to a series of civil wars, a more likely scenario than a zombie outbreak. Zombies are just the most interesting. Your friend and mine, Drewblet. |
 ZombieSurvival101 |
11. RE: Oppinions
Jul 4 2009, 9:26 PM EDT
Uhh... Drewblet? Do you have any E-books that tell you how to make improvised weaponry, ballistics, and anything else of that sort? If so, PM me, and I'll give you my e-mail.~ZS101 |
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Drewblet |
12. RE: Oppinions
Jul 4 2009, 10:03 PM EDT
I have almost every one available on the internet.PM sent. |
 MajorDamage |
13. RE: Oppinions
Oct 7 2009, 6:02 PM EDT
your profile? It just doesn't capture all of you.
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 John199312 |
14. RE: Oppinions
Nov 19 2009, 5:05 AM EST
"I have almost every one available on the internet.Heh, how accurate are they? And you do need to PM me anyway... *Eyes begin twitching* Maybe I should sleep, I'm well past the twenty-eight hour mark. Again. Nothing on you I'm sure. I think a lot of active members suffer from insomnia, or voluntarily suffer from it. |
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John199312 |
15. RE: Oppinions
Nov 19 2009, 3:18 PM EST
Anyone else realize Drew is as bad at correctly spelling thread titles as I am?
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Drewblet |
16. RE: Opinions
Dec 8 2009, 6:15 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 8 2009, 10:39 PM EST
"Anyone else realize Drew is as bad at correctly spelling thread titles as I am?"Forsooth, thou shalt perish within a raging inferno for to this loathsome atrocity, for I hath gleaned much favour with the gods through the holy sacrifice of the impudent. >:-D Much favour, indeed. Besides that, I'm the darkness; I own all you base. Albeit, there seems to be a middle-aged psychologist all up in my darkness nowadays. Anywho, most all of the eBooks are quite accurate. Lemme know if you'd like any. |
 3DayAsylum |
17. RE: Opinions
Dec 14 2009, 10:48 PM EST
Thou owneth all thine's bases, but thou shant receive the daybreak in which mine base is under thoueth's control.Besides, I'm the major darkness. Lil' Drewby is the lesser darkness. He just has illusions of grandeur. |
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John199312 |
18. RE: Opinions
Dec 15 2009, 11:36 AM EST
"Forsooth, thou shalt perish within a raging inferno for to this loathsome atrocity, for I hath gleaned much favour with the gods through the holy sacrifice of the impudent.Certainly. @3Day ROFL |
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Drewblet |
19. RE: Opinions
Dec 16 2009, 10:26 PM EST
"Thou owneth all thine's bases, but thou shant receive the daybreak in which mine base is under thoueth's control.Hm. Little do the small men know. At any rate, bear the following passage in mind: "And the beast shall come forth surrounded by a roiling cloud of vengeance. The house of the unbelievers shall be razed and they shall be scorched to the earth. And lo! they shall be subjected to eternal suffering in the name of the beast." From t3h Book o' Drew, 12:10 You are a mere speck on the shoulder of the truth. You are nothing; insignificant. Submit or be subjugated. Accede or be annexed. You, sir, are the naive little boy with the delusions of grandeur. And remember, Asylum, I know where you live. You would do very well to ask yourself, "Do I know where my base is?" |
