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Original-Sin |
Im going to have to disagree
Jul 25 2009, 9:24 PM EDT
I personally think shotguns are a great weapon against all matter of ZEDS. True, their downside is they lack the range to take care of far off ZEDS but I wouldn't want to engage ZEDS at a long range anyway. Why? Because why should you waste your limited ammo on a zombie you can so easily get away from? Ammunition should be conserved to a last case basis, no reason to waste it picking off a handful of zombies when there are going to be millions more of them to take their place.A shotgun is a nice weapon because of it's stopping power, brute force, and disregard of precise aiming. You can fire a pistol all day at a zombie at mid-range and stand a good chance of not scoring a headshot. A shotgun is a simple weapon that many survivors can learn to use proficiently and really shine in tight quarters like inside a building (Where you will be doing the MAJORITY of your raiding to keep alive) where as your bolt action rifle capable of taking a ZED down at hundreds of feet away becomes much less useful. Aim near the head and you are almost assured an instant kill, aim at the legs in a hurry and you certainly gain a huge advantage over a crawling skinjob, and also can easily behead them with a nearby shovel or smash their head in without wasting any more ammo. In short, don't leave your shotgun behind just cause you cant kill something a mile away with it. Take it with you and hold on to it for dear life because you will be more than happy enough to have it when you are raiding a Zed-Infested Wal-Mart for the supplies you need. And what stops you from carrying that rifle on your back and your pistol in your belt at the same time? Nothing 'cept a good few more pounds of equipment.. and if you cant handle that then you shouldnt be the one doing the raiding. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?
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byates |
1. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 25 2009, 9:58 PM EDT
"A shotgun is a nice weapon because of it's stopping power, brute force, and disregard of precise aiming. Aim near the head and you are almost assured an instant kill, aim at the legs in a hurry and you certainly gain a huge advantage over a crawling skinjob, and also can easily behead them with a nearby shovel or smash their head in without wasting any more ammo.A couple of points. You can aim less precisely than with a pistol or rifle, but it still requires aiming. You want the center of the pattern to be the same as the center of the point of aim. The ammo you use must be capable of penetrating the skull. To take out the legs you need to destroy the bone or joints, not just skin and muscle. Do you find this valuable? |
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timberrattler |
2. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 25 2009, 11:37 PM EDT
I agree on most of your points but I'm with byates on the "requires aiming" part. A shotgun is not the weapon that many people make it out to be. The way you described it makes me think you came to this conclusion from hours of gaming. I may be way off base here and I will admit I haven't shot the legs out from under anyone ever but the points byates makes are valid.
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Akerris |
3. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 26 2009, 7:41 AM EDT
You rant that much and you don't even bring up the fact that shotgun ammo comes in several different varieties? Won't you be surprised when you load slugs into your twelve gauge and expect "not to aim".
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Akerris |
4. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 26 2009, 7:44 AM EDT
" A shotgun is a simple weapon that many survivors can learn to use proficiently and really shine in tight quarters like inside a building (Where you will be doing the MAJORITY of your raiding to keep alive) where as your bolt action rifle capable of taking a ZED down at hundreds of feet away becomes much less useful.Two points. A bolt action rifle aimed and fired at close range is still very lethal. Wal Mart is a death trap. Think Black Friday x 10...... Do you find this valuable? |
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thebayouboy |
5. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 26 2009, 10:33 AM EDT
| Post edited: Jul 26 2009, 10:44 AM EDT
The only negative thing about a shotgun for me is ammo weight, everything else I love.
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LWJ2009 |
6. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 26 2009, 10:41 AM EDT
"I agree on most of your points but I'm with byates on the "requires aiming" part. A shotgun is not the weapon that many people make it out to be. The way you described it makes me think you came to this conclusion from hours of gaming. I may be way off base here and I will admit I haven't shot the legs out from under anyone ever but the points byates makes are valid."Ditto you still have to aim a shotgun to hit your target. Also unlike the wonderful xbox you have to learn how to lead some of your targets as well. Not everything you shoot at is going to run /fly straight at you, or run/fly away from you. 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Carnack |
7. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 26 2009, 10:42 AM EDT
"Ditto you still have to aim a shotgun to hit your target. Also unlike the wonderful xbox you have to learn how to lead some of your targets as well. Not everything you shoot at is going to run /fly straight at you, or run/fly away from you. "That's something I have trouble with sometimes. I get impatient and louse the shot. Do you find this valuable? |
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LWJ2009 |
8. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 26 2009, 11:02 AM EDT
| Post edited: Jul 26 2009, 11:04 AM EDT
"That's something I have trouble with sometimes. I get impatient and louse the shot."The last guffaw I had bird hunting was pretty embarssing for me. I finally decided to buy an over under shotgun and picked up a Winchester Select 12 guage with a 28 inch barrel. Well the shotgun is set to fire the bottom barrel first and then the top. I was used to using pump guns so this fact would haunt me on my first trip with my precious. I was walking and out of the corner of my eye I see this head bob, and turn around to see a rooster walking next to me about 4 yards away. With a flash and a grin I shoulder my shotgun and put the bead on said roosters head. He starts to take off and I squeeze the trigger, thinking I am going to blow his head off. Instead the bottom barrel goes off and I blew his ass off. Tail feathers fly all over the place and he manages to get airborne, so I hit him with the other barrel, and he goes into the glide and dies in some very nasty scrub. After 15 minutes of searching, I could not find him and said F it. It was a great transition lesson. 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Original-Sin |
9. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 4:27 AM EDT
In my defense, I am a shotgun owner. I have a Mossberg 500 12gauge. And no, it would take an idiot to think you dont have to aim at all with a shotgun, Im simply implying you dont need to be as PRECISE. A inch or two off target is a completely different thing with a shotgun and a pistol/rifle at close range.And yes, thanks for the reminder of the different ammo types, another huge advantage to owning a shotgun. And yes, im aware they make other ammunition types for rifles and pistols as well. Do you find this valuable? |
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Akerris |
10. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 7:03 AM EDT
"In my defense, I am a shotgun owner. I have a Mossberg 500 12gauge. And no, it would take an idiot to think you dont have to aim at all with a shotgun, Im simply implying you dont need to be as PRECISE. A inch or two off target is a completely different thing with a shotgun and a pistol/rifle at close range.Shotgun's diversity of ammo I feel is its greatest strength. Unfortunately the huge and heavy shells are also its biggest disadvantage. Shotguns are good if you have the space to carry the ammo. Compare carrying 200 .30-06 vs 200 12 gauge shells. Do you find this valuable? |
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Whybother08 |
11. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 8:27 AM EDT
For as long as I'm travelling on foot, I will be using my dad's semi-auto 12 guage. Ammo is about as common as it gets, and has the stopping power I want. People often complain about how it lacks effective range, but the way I see it , if I can see a zed 200 yards away and I have time to lay down a precise shot, I'm sneaking away.
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necroslaughter |
12. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 2:18 PM EDT
| Post edited: Jul 27 2009, 2:21 PM EDT
My favorite shotgun story was as I was hanging around at the range BSing with the owner a van full of guys pulls up the radio so loud the windows were shaking, everyone in BDUs but no firearms, and NY plates (vacationers‼‼). Range staff goes “Oh-No-Rambos.” They come in pay the range fee sit through the 15 min do this don’t do that speech and say they want to rent the “Terminator Gun” a Mossberg with pistol grip the range instructor stands there watches as he tucks it into his shoulder and fires about four rounds. They BS a little the instructor walks away and sure as hell the guy raises the pistol griped shotgun to his face and learns that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. What a bloody (not the Queen’s English-I mean blood and teeth) mess. I laughed my ass off, only because they were acting like dick heads. When the ambulance left, we found little pieces of teeth on the ground and a mess of blood and skin on the back of the shotgun-hehehe. Second favorite is the guy with the NJ plates who again got the do this don’t do that speech and took the pistol grip shotgun with one hand and fired it. He shot the bench rest sending BBs ricocheting into everyone on the firing line. Oh shit the shotgun was heavy. I guess those Hollywood tricks don’t work in real life. He got to have a visit by the PA State Police and wounded two including one who had a ball penetrate his leg. Do you find this valuable? |
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Reaper37 |
13. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 2:35 PM EDT
"My favorite shotgun story was as I was hanging around at the range BSing with the owner a van full of guys pulls up the radio so loud the windows were shaking, everyone in BDUs but no firearms, and NY plates (vacationers‼‼). Range staff goes “Oh-No-Rambos.” They come in pay the range fee sit through the 15 min do this don’t do that speech and say they want to rent the “Terminator Gun” a Mossberg with pistol grip the range instructor stands there watches as he tucks it into his shoulder and fires about four rounds. They BS a little the instructor walks away and sure as hell the guy raises the pistol griped shotgun to his face and learns that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. What a bloody (not the Queen’s English-I mean blood and teeth) mess. I laughed my ass off, only because they were acting like dick heads. When the ambulance left, we found little pieces of teeth on the ground and a mess of blood and skin on the back of the shotgun-hehehe.That first little show would have been hilarious. I would have laughed at the guy all the way till he was loaded into the back of the ambulance, some people should not ever weild a firearm, because there are alot of morons out there that think they can act just as those in the movies. On the shotgun topic, i own a mossberg maverick 88 that has been modified to a tactical look. Anyhow i love my shotgun, does its job nicely with targets in range, and thats with just the bird shot. I will always keep a shotty at hand. Do you find this valuable? |
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NorCal_Survivors |
14. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 2:43 PM EDT
| Post edited: Jul 27 2009, 2:45 PM EDT
necro's story is another practical example of why I recommend that new shooters ALWAYS start with a 22LR rifle ... even their goal is to own/learn/shoot a shotgun or even a handgun. So many "it's a powerful, dangerous and deadly tool" lessons can be learned with less possibility of early ignorance leading to injury.In the specific case of the shotgun, a new shooter can experiment to learn where his "pocket" with a 22LR rifle, without risking the beginners usual bruising and (rare but, it happens) dislocation of the shoulder. It's also easier and safer to practice various carry, ready and firing positions. Also, shotgun skills should always be learned - IMHO - first with birdshot and then with buck and slugs, for similar reasons. You learn that you do indeed need to "point" (shotgunner's term ... same as "aim") the weapon, observe patterning behavior and get first-hand experience as to the pros/cons of this weapon system. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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necroslaughter |
15. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 3:01 PM EDT
"necro's story is another practical example of why I recommend that new shooters ALWAYS start with a 22LR rifle ... even their goal is to own/learn/shoot a shotgun or even a handgun. So many "it's a powerful, dangerous and deadly tool" lessons can be learned with less possibility of early ignorance leading to injury.Yeah but is much funnier for the people watching when they start with a 12 gauge magnum slug. I rarely soot at the range except for the summer it’s like watching NASCAR for the accidents. All the out of state people on vacation feel cheated if they can’t shoot a .44 magnum, DE .50AE, or the “Terminator Gun.” It is funny as all hell because I have heard the range owner, inform, warn, and beg people not to rent a particular weapon but they always do what they want. Did I mention that there are two NRA certified instructors behind the firing line who will shoot you if they think you are going off the deep end? I think this is a great idea and was put in place after a man “accidentally shot his wife (twice) at a western PA range. They always try to start people out on .22 cal rifles and either a .38 or 9mm handgun. It never works. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Thorn_of_kabolis |
16. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 3:22 PM EDT
that is one of the funniest shotgun stories ive heard. but personaly im not a shotgun person, because all the ones ive shot dont have sights they just have the bead on the end, that and the stocks on them were too short so every shot i would like punch myself in the face, just like with an SKS.but these were realy old shotguns so i guess newer ones would be better Do you find this valuable? |
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Reaper37 |
17. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 3:32 PM EDT
"that is one of the funniest shotgun stories ive heard. but personaly im not a shotgun person, because all the ones ive shot dont have sights they just have the bead on the end, that and the stocks on them were too short so every shot i would like punch myself in the face, just like with an SKS.Thats why on my shotgun, i put the pistol grip with the six position telescopic stock just like whats on the M-4 assault rifle, makes it much nicer. As for the sights, i also installed a heat shield with ghost sights on it, very nice. Do you find this valuable? |
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inu-dude25 |
18. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 4:32 PM EDT
"In my defense, I am a shotgun owner. I have a Mossberg 500 12gauge. And no, it would take an idiot to think you dont have to aim at all with a shotgun, Im simply implying you dont need to be as PRECISE. A inch or two off target is a completely different thing with a shotgun and a pistol/rifle at close range.With certain types of buckshot, yes you can be slightly off-center and still deliver a crippling/lethal blow. With slugs, you're basically shooting a rifle. And birdshot will be unlikely to deliver a kill-shot unless your aim is dead-on at very close range. Do you find this valuable? |
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necroslaughter |
19. RE: Im going to have to disagree
Jul 27 2009, 4:49 PM EDT
"that is one of the funniest shotgun stories ive heard. but personaly im not a shotgun person, because all the ones ive shot dont have sights they just have the bead on the end, that and the stocks on them were too short so every shot i would like punch myself in the face, just like with an SKS.My Mossberg 500 only has a bead and had I not used a shotgun in the Marines and realized the there was no way to control the recoil with a pistol grip I may have fell for that, God I hope I am too smart to have done it. I knew it was coming and had they not been so arrogant I was close enough to stop him-maybe but I figured WTF and besides I wanted the space. The range during tourist season is better than an amusement park. I like it so much that instead of going out behind my house to shoot I get up, shower get dressed, and drive 15+ miles each way just for kicks. It’s like watching NASCAR just for the accidents-which I do as well. Do you find this valuable? |