Location: Zombie Survival & Defense Wiki Discussion Forum

Discussion: Criticism against the ZSGReported This is a featured thread

Showing 1 - 20 of 76  |  Show  posts at a time
2 3 4 | Next
FrenchLegion
FrenchLegion
Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 1:06 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 1:08 PM EDT
There has probably been a lot of threads about the ZSG specifically, but I would like to know from this community why there is a substantial amount of criticism for it here. I'm neither defending the ZSG nor going against it. I would just like to hear a concise list of what people are actually upset about the guide here.

And, if you would, actually give reasons other then give sneeringly remarks like "it will get people killed" and such. Be more specific if you can.


Oh and, for some reason there's a LOT of tags attached. Dunno why :\
1  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
Carnack
Carnack
1. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 1:38 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 1:38 PM EDT
"There has probably been a lot of threads about the ZSG specifically, but I would like to know from this community why there is a substantial amount of criticism for it here. I'm neither defending the ZSG nor going against it. I would just like to hear a concise list of what people are actually upset about the guide here.

And, if you would, actually give reasons other then give sneeringly remarks like "it will get people killed" and such. Be more specific if you can.


Oh and, for some reason there's a LOT of tags attached. Dunno why :\"
It states zombie behaviors in absolutes even though there are no zombies.
5  out of 9 found this valuable. Do you?    
wulfstahg
wulfstahg
2. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 2:46 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 2:46 PM EDT
It is in fact supposed to be a parody, merely a joke. For a joke, I'd have to say it's a pretty good book. Some of the things written concerning explosives and the use of more conventional war techniques is a little bit skewed, but it is meant for civilians... 4  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
PedroAsani
PedroAsani
3. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 3:21 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 3:21 PM EDT
Whilst I would say that stating an opinion as fact on the board is verboten, in your own published work, it is pretty much a given.

ZSG is a parody of all the survival manuals that were written around the turn of the millenium. Max Brooks decided on an archetype, and wrote the Guide as a way to survive attacks by that archetype. You can't fault they guy because of the premise of the book.
4  out of 4 found this valuable. Do you?    
PedroAsani
PedroAsani
4. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 3:26 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 3:26 PM EDT
My criticism of it would be in a few places, mainly that they can survive for so long in salt water (covered more in WWZ, but stands as part of the archetype) without providing any kind of explanation. Since he covers the science reasonably well in most of the areas (regardless of your opinion of Solanum's likelihood, he did the research into viruses, which is more than Romero does) it does seem a bit lax to not only leave this point uncovered, but highlight it in the following book.

Another is that the guide as a whole is very American. I'm not just talking the firearms section, but the general feel is that it is an American guide for American people, rather than a global guide that happens to be written by an American. Whilst covering all the world's cultures in one book would be an impossible task, it could have been a little less skewed to one demographic.
5  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
nate121
nate121
5. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 4:01 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 4:01 PM EDT
yes very american
however his advice to fill your bath tub with water and to destroy the stairs is in many peoples plans on this site
1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
PedroAsani
PedroAsani
6. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 4:06 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 4:06 PM EDT
"yes very american
however his advice to fill your bath tub with water and to destroy the stairs is in many peoples plans on this site"
I'm not saying it doesn't have good advice. There is a lot of good stuff in there, more than there is bad.

However, it is far from The One True Book Showing The Right Way To Survive Zombies. You do tend to get people who have read the ZSG, only the ZSG and decided it is their Gospel.
1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
DevilNuts
DevilNuts
7. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 4:20 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 4:20 PM EDT
The ZSG while entertaining, would have very little real-world application. Much of the subject material is simply factually inaccurate.

For a true survivalist and not the comic book fan boy, factually inaccurate equals failure.


For what it's worth however, I do think that the reason ZSG has sold so well is *because* of it's parody nature and that when written, had it contained a more serious tone would have been laughed off the shelves. The world is not quite ready for serious mainstream zombie survivalism...... yet.
4  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
FrenchLegion
FrenchLegion
8. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 6:23 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 6:23 PM EDT
"My criticism of it would be in a few places, mainly that they can survive for so long in salt water (covered more in WWZ, but stands as part of the archetype) without providing any kind of explanation. Since he covers the science reasonably well in most of the areas (regardless of your opinion of Solanum's likelihood, he did the research into viruses, which is more than Romero does) it does seem a bit lax to not only leave this point uncovered, but highlight it in the following book.

Another is that the guide as a whole is very American. I'm not just talking the firearms section, but the general feel is that it is an American guide for American people, rather than a global guide that happens to be written by an American. Whilst covering all the world's cultures in one book would be an impossible task, it could have been a little less skewed to one demographic."
Yes, it doesn't consider us Frenchmen into play, right? We don't have access to guns. All we have access to is stale baguettes and cheap wine.
6  out of 8 found this valuable. Do you?    
MajorDamage
MajorDamage
9. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 6:25 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 6:25 PM EDT
"Yes, it doesn't consider us Frenchmen into play, right? We don't have access to guns. All we have access to is stale baguettes and cheap wine. "
what? no escargo?
2  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
SasquatchJim
SasquatchJim
10. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 7:39 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 7:39 PM EDT
I agree with what Pedro said. It's too American. Actually, Brroks kinda points this out at one point: "there are more civilian gunshops than military armories in the US (a pattern shared by the rest of the world)..." I think he was saying that he knew he was mainly writing about the US, but it was going to sell the most copies there.

Also, I think that it relied to much on one idea of a zombie (slow, idiotic) without giving ideas on how to combat the others (though Max did so purposely, I believe, since that is the most common zombie seen in movies.)

However, there is one thing I do have to praise the book for: introducing people to zombies. Were it not for this book, I probably wouldn't have found this site.
3  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    
inu-dude25
inu-dude25
11. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 7:59 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 7:59 PM EDT
"Yes, it doesn't consider us Frenchmen into play, right? We don't have access to guns. All we have access to is stale baguettes and cheap wine. "
Well, it does seem that a lot of the content is just generic, common sense advice (which is admittedly a rare thing these days).

While no singular book could cover every scenario in every location, you can still take the general survival tips and create your own strategy that fits your environment and situation.

Just don't put too much faith in the claims of how zombies will act, whether or not .22's will bounce around in a skull, and any other "facts" that are subjective and unprovable one way or the other.
2  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
FrenchLegion
FrenchLegion
12. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 8:26 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 8:26 PM EDT
As much as I really despise Sprinters, I (reluctantly) agree. One needs to be open to any scale of attack, the type of infection/zombie, and so on. 1  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
Whybother08
Whybother08
13. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Sep 21 2009, 9:41 PM EDT | Post edited: Sep 21 2009, 9:41 PM EDT
I have never read the book, but it angers me that people:

1. Sometimes take this book as FACT. I am tired of people saying that there are recorded outbreaks of Solanum, and like Pedro once said, never wondered why that crap never came up in history class. Or why zombie survival wasn't taught as if it were just another part of life.

2. Need to see common sense ideas on paper to realize them. The ZSG has some good advice, but all of it is based on things you can figure out by yourself. His firearms points are a bit misinformed, though. And strictly for the U.S. crowd.
3  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
SasquatchJim
SasquatchJim
14. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Oct 19 2009, 5:10 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 19 2009, 5:10 PM EDT
"His firearms points are a bit misinformed, though. And strictly for the U.S. crowd.

Or why zombie survival wasn't taught as if it were just another part of life."
Little bit of a necro-post, but there's something I need to say: anyone who can effectively shoot a crossbow out to a quarter mile (like Brooks said) give me a call.

And, god I wish zombie survival was taught as a part of life; that would be sweet!
7  out of 7 found this valuable. Do you?    
JohnHarrison
JohnHarrison
15. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Oct 19 2009, 6:09 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 19 2009, 6:09 PM EDT
My problem, and my problem with world war z is that if the body was truly dead, bacteria and stuff would be eating it up from the inside as well as weathering... I honestly don't think Zombies could keep walking for more than a year.
1  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    
SasquatchJim
SasquatchJim
16. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Oct 19 2009, 8:49 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 19 2009, 8:50 PM EDT
"My problem, and my problem with world war z is that if the body was truly dead, bacteria and stuff would be eating it up from the inside as well as weathering... I honestly don't think Zombies could keep walking for more than a year.
"
I think Brooks tries to explain that (in "decomposition") but, in all honesty, it wasn't very good.
2  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
John_234
John_234
17. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Oct 19 2009, 8:58 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 19 2009, 8:58 PM EDT
"I think Brooks tries to explain that (in "decomposition") but, in all honesty, it wasn't very good."
He said something about Solanum saturating the body, killing other germs...
1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
SasquatchJim
SasquatchJim
18. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Oct 19 2009, 9:07 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 19 2009, 9:07 PM EDT
"He said something about Solanum saturating the body, killing other germs..."
Oh, thanks. I couldn't remember exactly what he said.
0  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
JohnHarrison
JohnHarrison
19. RE: Criticism against the ZSG
Oct 20 2009, 5:54 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 20 2009, 5:54 PM EDT
eh I still don't feel convinced. 0  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
2 3 4 | Next

Related Content

  (what's this?Related ContentThanks to keyword tags, links to related pages and threads are added to the bottom of your pages. Up to 15 links are shown, determined by matching tags and by how recently the content was updated; keeping the most current at the top. Share your feedback on Wetpaint Central.)