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Discussion: Real-World Zombie BiologyReported This is a featured thread

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StrykerPez
StrykerPez
Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 2:58 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 2:58 PM EDT
This thread is here for all of us to contribute INTELLIGENTLY and come to a basic conclusion as to what would be the REAL WORLD causes and symptoms of being infected with Virus Z. I plan to eventually make this into a well put together page.

With the large variety of fictional zombies out there, (slow, fast, dead, undead, alive, smart, dumb, trainable, friendly, violent, mutated, radioactive, instant, delayed, etc) I find it very hard to say which ones are "right" and which ones are "wrong."

Furthermore, with the advances in the sciences and medicine, along with humanity's drive for the better cure or the better weapon, we will eventually create zombies. And I'm not talking movie zombies. Call me nuts, but I think that it is all too possible for something to go wrong and the world to end up infected.

That being said, I typically try to find the most likely scenario that would realistically produce what we like to call zombies.

For example, I discount the notion that they eat brains or are slow and uncoordinated. The brain is one of the more well-protected organs in the body. There are far easier ways to get nutrition, and for an outbreak to be truly effective, the zombie would have to be a perfectly formed vicious predator, not a mindless, shuffling corpse that wants brains.

So. Lets look at everything here like Darwinists: discount the ideas that would make for an inefficient predator, support the ideas that would lead to a zombie's success, throw away anything based in the realm of magic and fancy, and when we're done we will have the "perfect" zombie.
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StrykerPez
StrykerPez
1. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:01 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:01 PM EDT
First of all, would they be dead, un-dead, or alive?

I maintain that zombies were and are not actually dead (due to the far fetched nature of the idea). Reanimation is very difficult. Muscle tissue, nerve tissue, blood, and pretty much everything else in the human body begins to break down at death. For a corpse more than a day old or so to get up and run at me would be just as ridiculous as the plastic skeleton from Biology Class in highschool running at me.

instead I say they suffered from a severe fever during the incubation and manifestation of the infection that put them into a coma, only making them appear dead. With that standpoint, decay or decomposition would not be a problem in the long term.
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StrykerPez
StrykerPez
2. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:03 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:03 PM EDT
There is no proof that they are coldblooded. In fact (referencing fiction) the zombies in my story "As The World Dies" have higher body temperatures. Which would give the biological advantage to a creature that used to be a mammal but now survives on only the barest of essentials? Hot-blooded, warm-blooded, or cold-blooded?
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Carnack
Carnack
3. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:06 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:12 PM EDT
They'd be alive but with only a certain level of intelligence and no higher reasoning. It WOULD however be adaptable. Think wolf. I say this because if they DID have higher reasoning they wouldn't be flipping out. Of course this opens up the "how" question. 4  out of 4 found this valuable. Do you?    
StrykerPez
StrykerPez
4. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:11 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:11 PM EDT
That's where I get my fever and coma thinking. The fever destroyed enough of the brain to reduce mental function to the most base violent instincts of survival and emotion (which are food, water, and anger), and while most people would die from such a fever, the virus would keep the host alive. Eventually the fever subsided and the host wakes up.

I offer this as Exhibit A: Headshots are pointless. If the reason for Zombism is that their brains are destroyed (which makes sense doesn't it) then what good is shooting them in the brain going to do??? You'd have to get a brain stem shot, because that is where those base instincts and bodily function (heartbeat, breathing, etc) control comes from.
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Carnack
Carnack
5. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:14 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:14 PM EDT
"That's where I get my fever and coma thinking. The fever destroyed enough of the brain to reduce mental function to the most base violent instincts of survival and emotion (which are food, water, and anger), and while most people would die from such a fever, the virus would keep the host alive. Eventually the fever subsided and the host wakes up.

I offer this as Exhibit A: Headshots are pointless. If the reason for Zombism is that their brains are destroyed (which makes sense doesn't it) then what good is shooting them in the brain going to do??? You'd have to get a brain stem shot, because that is where those base instincts and bodily function (heartbeat, breathing, etc) control comes from."
To the first bit it could be as simple as a suppresion of higher reasoning making the infected short-sighted and devoid of the programming we aquire to live in society.

And since the brain sends impulses telling us to move a brain shot would damage the whole body.
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StrykerPez
StrykerPez
6. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:17 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:18 PM EDT
"....suppresion of higher reasoning making the infected short-sighted and devoid of the programming...."
So basically just rude, pissed off muthafụckas with no morals or sense of pain?
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Carnack
Carnack
7. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:20 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:24 PM EDT
"So basically just rude, pissed off muthafụckas with no morals or sense of pain? "
Possibly animals with a lack of emotional buffers. The condition has driven out all reasoning skills in favor of devoting all knowlege and ability to the hunting of prey.
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tooling
tooling
8. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:40 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:40 PM EDT
Would this mean that the bodies would remain just as fragile as humans but with the absence of pain being a factor? Being they are alive damage to the lungs, heart, blood loss, etc. could kill a zombie just like a regular person? 3  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    
Carnack
Carnack
9. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 8 2009, 3:45 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 8 2009, 3:45 PM EDT
"Would this mean that the bodies would remain just as fragile as humans but with the absence of pain being a factor? Being they are alive damage to the lungs, heart, blood loss, etc. could kill a zombie just like a regular person?"
Possibly. Assuming that cell replication is the same. If not then there'd be big problems.
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tooling
tooling
10. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 1:49 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 1:49 AM EDT
"Possibly. Assuming that cell replication is the same. If not then there'd be big problems."
True if the virus changes cell replication anything could happen. That could cause serious mutations is every part of the human anatomy. Also weird question can zombies reproduce like other organisms?
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Carnack
Carnack
11. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 2:05 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 2:05 AM EDT
"True if the virus changes cell replication anything could happen. That could cause serious mutations is every part of the human anatomy. Also weird question can zombies reproduce like other organisms?"
Not what I meant. If their bodies where like ours save for rapid cell replication they would (most likely) heal quickly. This could cause other mutation but it would be like cancer (a mutation in and of itself).
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survivortype
survivortype
12. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 3:09 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 3:14 AM EDT
High on PCP, with healing factor. Swell. The only part of this that doesn't suck is that you don't have to take the head shot.
(edit, didn't read whole thread) Oh, wait. You may have to take the head shot anyway? It just keeps getting better and better.
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Carnack
Carnack
13. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 3:12 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 3:12 AM EDT
"High on PCP, with healing factor. Swell. The only part of this that doesn't suck is that you don't have to take the head shot."
Well a headshot Would end things but so would extreme body trauma.
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survivortype
survivortype
14. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 3:29 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 3:29 AM EDT
What's the transmission vector? There are plenty of options that pathogens use in the real world.
Insect bites, sneezes, kissing, doorknobs, toilet seats, improperly prepared food, take your pick.
Also, how long can you spread it before symptoms appear? Ebola limits itself, it kills too quickly.
The longer you're contagious, the farther the illness can spread, and the harder it is to fight.
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Carnack
Carnack
15. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 3:33 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 3:33 AM EDT
"What's the transmission vector? There are plenty of options that pathogens use in the real world.
Insect bites, sneezes, kissing, doorknobs, toilet seats, improperly prepared food, take your pick.
Also, how long can you spread it before symptoms appear? Ebola limits itself, it kills too quickly.
The longer you're contagious, the farther the illness can spread, and the harder it is to fight."
It could be a spore. Or a parasite. Heck it can also be bioweapon (the most realistic).
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tooling
tooling
16. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 4:22 AM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 4:22 AM EDT
"It could be a spore. Or a parasite. Heck it can also be bioweapon (the most realistic). "
Also will it eventualy be fatal? Im thinking some sort of paracidic virus that somehow damages the brain. this way its possible that as long as the host continues to feed, etc. the virus could live in it. Also this would require zombies to drink water or something which would prove difficult for them to figure out in a large city.
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kinelta
kinelta
17. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 2:15 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 2:20 PM EDT
"What's the transmission vector? "
Do you think maybe some environmental factor (unknown) could cause part of a person's immune system to turn on them, rather like type 1 diabetes? I'm thinking some specific antibody that would attack certain parts of the brain.

(I say this because in Type 1 diabetes the person's immune system is triggered to attack the beta cells of the pancreas. Granted there is a genetic component in this, but there is speculation that there is an unknown environmental factor that triggers the body into producing antibodies, hence an increasing rate of type 1 diagnoses)

Just a different way of producing a zombie I guess, rather than a virus causing high fever to kill off parts of the brain.

edit: spelling
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Carnack
Carnack
18. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 4:43 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 4:43 PM EDT
"Also will it eventualy be fatal? Im thinking some sort of paracidic virus that somehow damages the brain. this way its possible that as long as the host continues to feed, etc. the virus could live in it. Also this would require zombies to drink water or something which would prove difficult for them to figure out in a large city. "
Humans aren't really good with eating raw meat. With all the parasites and microbes I wouldn't be shocked if it did kill off its host. It just wouldn't be a direct death.
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tooling
tooling
19. RE: Real-World Zombie Biology
Oct 9 2009, 5:53 PM EDT | Post edited: Oct 9 2009, 5:53 PM EDT
"Humans aren't really good with eating raw meat. With all the parasites and microbes I wouldn't be shocked if it did kill off its host. It just wouldn't be a direct death."
very true but if we are talking changes in cell replication anything could be possible.
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