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richboy33lb
richboy33lb
Umm
Feb 14 2010, 2:24 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 14 2010, 2:24 PM EST
Well, Evacuation has always been intended to happen BEFORE the catastrophe. When people don't evacuate, disaster happens, such as during Hurricane Katrina and the Jews who didn't evacuate Germany before the Holocaust. It is in human nature to think you will survive no matter what. And rendevous will probably bring infected to you or at least people who will hinder you. Think about it. A 31-year old woman or man who has never left their respective state comes to you without even the simple know-how of how to clean a wound or unjam a handgun. That is a hindrance. 6  out of 6 found this valuable. Do you?    
Keyword tags: call signs
PedroAsani
PedroAsani
1. RE: Umm
Feb 14 2010, 3:56 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 14 2010, 3:56 PM EST
"Well, Evacuation has always been intended to happen BEFORE the catastrophe. <snip>

And rendevous will probably bring infected to you or at least people who will hinder you. Think about it. A 31-year old woman or man who has never left their respective state comes to you without even the simple know-how of how to clean a wound or unjam a handgun. That is a hindrance."
Actually, evacuations can, are planned to, and do take place AFTER disasters as well as before. People are removed from a dangerous zone to a safe one. Timing is not really relevant, though obviously preferable.

As for bringing infected or useless people, yes, that is a possibility. But an RVE is well away from your BOL. It allows you to vet people on neutral ground of your choosing. Just because someone turns up at your RVE, you are under no obligation to help or take them in.

But conversely, you might pick up willing, able bodied people who will be an asset to your group. These are options you would have with or without an RVE.

The point of an RVE for the creator is to allow you to communicate and screen people without revealing the location of your BOL. For the refugees who turn up, it is a safe way to approach strangers without spooking them and risking being shot by someone who was on guard duty too long and mistakes them for Raiders or zombies.

Personally, when I have set up my RVE's, I will take anyone who submits to quarantine and disarming rules set up to protect the safety of my group. Doesn't matter if they are unskilled. I can teach people anything given their time and attention.

Rich, the RVE's are like last-resort apocalyptic bus-stops. If your plan falls through, you can head to the nearest RVE, and hope you get picked up. It's better than wandering aimlessly.
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richboy33lb
richboy33lb
2. RE: Umm
Feb 19 2010, 10:57 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 19 2010, 10:57 PM EST
"Actually, evacuations can, are planned to, and do take place AFTER disasters as well as before. People are removed from a dangerous zone to a safe one. Timing is not really relevant, though obviously preferable.

As for bringing infected or useless people, yes, that is a possibility. But an RVE is well away from your BOL. It allows you to vet people on neutral ground of your choosing. Just because someone turns up at your RVE, you are under no obligation to help or take them in.

But conversely, you might pick up willing, able bodied people who will be an asset to your group. These are options you would have with or without an RVE.

The point of an RVE for the creator is to allow you to communicate and screen people without revealing the location of your BOL. For the refugees who turn up, it is a safe way to approach strangers without spooking them and risking being shot by someone who was on guard duty too long and mistakes them for Raiders or zombies.

Personally, when I have set up my RVE's, I will take anyone who submits to quarantine and disarming rules set up to protect the safety of my group. Doesn't matter if they are unskilled. I can teach people anything given their time and attention.

Rich, the RVE's are like last-resort apocalyptic bus-stops. If your plan falls through, you can head to the nearest RVE, and hope you get picked up. It's better than wandering aimlessly."
Yeah, I go to agree, but in most suburban or city areas, most people have never fired a gun, cleaned a wound, or dne anything more serious than applying a band-aid or avoiding traffic. Rural areas have "hillbilies" who fire guns for fun and will probably, for the most part, not only survive, but have fun killing Zak.
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Freelancer47
Freelancer47
3. RE: Umm
Feb 20 2010, 1:54 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 20 2010, 1:54 AM EST
"Yeah, I go to agree, but in most suburban or city areas, most people have never fired a gun, cleaned a wound, or dne anything more serious than applying a band-aid or avoiding traffic. Rural areas have "hillbilies" who fire guns for fun and will probably, for the most part, not only survive, but have fun killing Zak."
That's a powerful assumption here richboy33lb.

My .02 on the topic, and all the info I'm providing is from the 3 different countries I've lived in.

*USA (Chicago, Seattle, State of Georgia, Phoenix, etc)
*Frmr.Fed. Republic of Yugoslavia
*Iraq

I'm an 'Urban Cowboy'. I own firearms. I've dealt with more then just a cut & bandaid issue.

Don't forget- many Medium to Large cities have Gangs that shoot at people (think drive-by's) for the sake of proving yourself.

I agree about the Rural areas. The folks there are more rugged & self reliant then in most Urban areas. Heck, I'm in DT Seattle. If I get an injury, I have 3 top-notch hospitals in a 4 block radius.

There's a MOD here who lives out in the sticks of KY. He posted on a thread once that if something were to happen & he needed Police, Fire Department, or Paramedic help it would take over 40 minutes for help to arrive.

Hope this helps. Good to see more postings!
-FL47/Mick
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richboy33lb
richboy33lb
4. RE: Umm
Feb 20 2010, 7:00 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 20 2010, 7:00 PM EST
What I meant mostly is that in suburban/urban areas, there are hospitals, fast food places, etc. or things to reduce the amount of work necessary. Most cities, including my own, have gangs in them, but gangs are notorious for NOT GETTING ALONG. Most gangs, including "great ones" such as the Bloods and Crips, have fallen apart from infighting and greed. And unfortunately, most Americans, in a zombie war, would be eaten, killed, etc. because we are TOO independent thinking. Thousands, if not millions, of small outposts would be formed but almost all would fail. However, in other countries, such as Iraq, people will band together, helping each other out. 1  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
3DayAsylum
3DayAsylum
5. RE: Umm
Feb 20 2010, 7:29 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 20 2010, 7:29 PM EST
Wow, Richie-Richie Boy-Boy is back. Do you find this valuable?    
Freelancer47
Freelancer47
6. RE: Umm
Feb 20 2010, 8:03 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 20 2010, 8:03 PM EST
"Wow, Richie-Richie Boy-Boy is back."
No kidding right?

Where the heck you been richboy?

On Topic: you're partialy right about the Gangs & them 'falling apart'.

It's not so much falling apart as it is 'Evolving'... and not for the better. When it comes to Gangs, most Law Enforcement Agencies are more reactive then proactive simply due to the nature of the Gangs in question.

Think Nightmare Business Model=

Gang XYZ has been selling Crack Cocaine & running Prostitution in a Med size city (We'll call this city Camden)for the past 25 years. Gang XYZ has 5 members that have just discovered a large market for firearms in a near by city (lets say Parksburg). The 5 members want to expand business. The boss say's no. These 5 members form their own Gang, & start running weapons between Parksburg & Camden.

Mix with flour & water. Repeat.

Also, if you think the people of Iraq would pull together in a Zed Poc you are dead wrong. Tribal Politics are pretty big there. To this day, 7 years after the U.S.A.'s "Intervention" most of these tribes still don't know if they want to work with or against the U.S.A.
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richboy33lb
richboy33lb
7. RE: Umm
Feb 27 2010, 11:04 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 27 2010, 11:04 PM EST
I just generally meant that other countries will either fail miserably. I predict France, Japan, China, India, and Mexico will do just that.France and Japan have relatively large populations while having poor militaries. China and India have too many people for any armed force to conquer if they were humans, let alone zombies. Mexico will have thousands, if not millions of refugees passing through. However, I predict Ireland, Israel, Cuba, Nepal and New Zealand. Ireland, New Zealand, and Cuba are relatively isolated islands with accpetable armies to handle their populations and Nepal and srael have natural boundaries. We will come in the middle, with heavy casualties but also many survivors. Do you find this valuable?    
richboy33lb
richboy33lb
8. RE: Umm
Feb 27 2010, 11:05 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 27 2010, 11:05 PM EST
Also, i was never really gone, i just couldn't make any pages or edits. Do you find this valuable?    
Ready_For_Z-Day
Ready_For_Z-Day
9. RE: Umm
Nov 14 2010, 3:12 PM EST | Post edited: Nov 14 2010, 3:12 PM EST
What about a 13 year old who can handle guns and other weapons? I have handled shotguns, handguns, rifles, machetes and I have a good bit of upper body strength and endurance/stamina.I also have a BOB and my weaons ready, but I don't have an evac plan >_< Do you find this valuable?    
richboy33lb
richboy33lb
10. RE: Umm
Dec 27 2010, 11:09 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 27 2010, 11:09 PM EST
"Actually, evacuations can, are planned to, and do take place AFTER disasters as well as before. People are removed from a dangerous zone to a safe one. Timing is not really relevant, though obviously preferable.

As for bringing infected or useless people, yes, that is a possibility. But an RVE is well away from your BOL. It allows you to vet people on neutral ground of your choosing. Just because someone turns up at your RVE, you are under no obligation to help or take them in.

But conversely, you might pick up willing, able bodied people who will be an asset to your group. These are options you would have with or without an RVE.

The point of an RVE for the creator is to allow you to communicate and screen people without revealing the location of your BOL. For the refugees who turn up, it is a safe way to approach strangers without spooking them and risking being shot by someone who was on guard duty too long and mistakes them for Raiders or zombies.

Personally, when I have set up my RVE's, I will take anyone who submits to quarantine and disarming rules set up to protect the safety of my group. Doesn't matter if they are unskilled. I can teach people anything given their time and attention.

Rich, the RVE's are like last-resort apocalyptic bus-stops. If your plan falls through, you can head to the nearest RVE, and hope you get picked up. It's better than wandering aimlessly."
What I meant was it is always better to evacuate before TSHTF. I would rather have been in the traffic jam leaving New Orleans than in the hurricane, the flood, or the chaos that ensued afterward.
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ObviouslyABadIdea
11. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 8:08 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 8:08 PM EST
Bull. One of the most important spots is your home. Destroy the staircase, and always have an escape route incase your gas breaks. But if that would fail, then a supermarket or a small owned convinence store in the ghetto should suit your advantage. Malls such as in the fictional movie Dawn of The Dead would also be an advantage, but you should always make sure that it is deserted or that it has a ladder leading to the surface incase oxygen runs out. But if any such Military Quarantine would open, DO NOT PROCEDE TO THE QUARANTINE AREA. Overpopulation and possible infection would mean a deathtrap for anyone in that area. Avoid Military personal unless you are ABSOLUTLY POSITIVLY SURE THAT THE MILITARY S DOING SOMETHING THAT WILL HELP YOU COMPLETLY. 0  out of 4 found this valuable. Do you?    
Whybother08
Whybother08
12. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 8:36 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 8:36 PM EST
Lolwut

I'm wondering what would happen if I gave you a 5 lb. sledgehammer and told you to 'destroy the staircase'. It's not that easy. If anything get a rope emergency ladder in case you are trapped in the second floor, no need to waste all the space on the first floor.

Doubtful about the supermarket or convenience store. Both will almost be guaranteed to be emptied of anything useful, and you need a lot of manpower to cover a grocery store, and convenience stores are often placed in high-population areas.

Malls will get you killed. When they are open, they are filled with hundreds, if not thousands of people at any given time, and you will probably never see them 'abandoned', unless you clear it out yourself. And why would they run out of air?

Can't argue about not going to a 'military quarantine', though it is questionable if they would set one up in the first place. Same thing with military personnell shooting you on site.

My home is NOT at all fit for a zombie invasion, and after the initial panic, I am leaving for less populated areas. The Zombie Survival Guide can fill up my ass.
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timberrattler
timberrattler
13. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 8:43 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 8:43 PM EST
"Bull. One of the most important spots is your home. Destroy the staircase, and always have an escape route incase your gas breaks. But if that would fail, then a supermarket or a small owned convinence store in the ghetto should suit your advantage. Malls such as in the fictional movie Dawn of The Dead would also be an advantage, but you should always make sure that it is deserted or that it has a ladder leading to the surface incase oxygen runs out. But if any such Military Quarantine would open, DO NOT PROCEDE TO THE QUARANTINE AREA. Overpopulation and possible infection would mean a deathtrap for anyone in that area. Avoid Military personal unless you are ABSOLUTLY POSITIVLY SURE THAT THE MILITARY S DOING SOMETHING THAT WILL HELP YOU COMPLETLY."
I read Max Brooks book too. The Zombie Survival Guide will be in my BOB. In case I run out of toilet paper.
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jdi35
jdi35
14. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 9:23 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 9:23 PM EST
"I read Max Brooks book too. The Zombie Survival Guide will be in my BOB. In case I run out of toilet paper."
i'd rather take it along for possible tinder (and the occasional laugh), but to each their own i guess....
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BigLoki
BigLoki
15. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 10:00 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 10:00 PM EST
Hmmmm... lol

Evacuations "after the fact" are usually armed extractions. People both once good and bad, are usually bad due to their own panic, or having to deal with others' panic.

City folk aren't all exactly helpless either. There has been mention in other threads about the poor and "downtrodden" being dregs on society, and useless... but let's look at the reality of it for some (not all I know)

Gang activity is a breeding ground for: Small arms knowledge, threat assessment, thinking under pressure, understanding a "chain of command", basic medical skills (can't go to the hospital for every little thing with a warrant) scavenging (theiving, it's only different when there's no law), some even develop effective battle tactics, mechanical skills, and improvization.

Lack of cash in general breeds: coping/sacrificing ammenities that most count as necessities, scavenging, resourcefulness, and some others.

We may not be able to farm, or be gunsmiths, or any number of other things; but don't count us out offhandedly. Every skill a person has, had to be learned somewhere, or from someone. If put in a position to HAVE to learn outdoors skills, more than most people would guess will be able to do so. I learned some skills in the military, and through my own endeavors since then. I have no delusions that I can now start a small farm, and raise livestock, and crops and such... but those that can would likely find me very usefull should we come across eachother.

IMO, there will be those that have a hard time for lack of "urban" skills, and there will be those that have a hard time lacking "rural" skills. A"Big City" Doc. may not be able to mend your fence...but he can mend your ass, and is therefore mighty handy....lmao
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Whybother08
Whybother08
16. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 10:09 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 10:09 PM EST
You know, back in the fifties/sixties, being a 'commoner' in the city had a charm all it's own.

People used to own guns like people in the country do over here. Pretty much every elderly person I know had access to some form of .30-30 rifle, and often more than that. They did understand the value of hard work and discipline. They may not, in general, be able to farm, but most of the people I know from that era (my dad, grandfather, along with a few family friends) all know their way around tools. My grandfather was fixing radios for money by the time he was 12! That's what the Army grabbed him for!

Like T-rat said, it's not one or the other is better. We're all getting soft.
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VagabondVance
VagabondVance
17. RE: Umm
Jan 1 2011, 10:17 PM EST | Post edited: Jan 1 2011, 10:17 PM EST
"A"Big City" Doc. may not be able to mend your fence...but he can mend your ass, and is therefore mighty handy....lmao"
"Paging Doctor Seymour Butts to the Operating Room"
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SeeZEvil
SeeZEvil
18. RE: Umm
Jan 2 2011, 12:48 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2011, 12:48 AM EST
"Bull. One of the most important spots is your home. Destroy the staircase, and always have an escape route incase your gas breaks. But if that would fail, then a supermarket or a small owned convinence store in the ghetto should suit your advantage. Malls such as in the fictional movie Dawn of The Dead would also be an advantage, but you should always make sure that it is deserted or that it has a ladder leading to the surface incase oxygen runs out. But if any such Military Quarantine would open, DO NOT PROCEDE TO THE QUARANTINE AREA. Overpopulation and possible infection would mean a deathtrap for anyone in that area. Avoid Military personal unless you are ABSOLUTLY POSITIVLY SURE THAT THE MILITARY S DOING SOMETHING THAT WILL HELP YOU COMPLETLY."
My home is a small apartment on top of a garage, the only way in or out is up the stairs, which goes up, makes a 90 degree angle at a landing, and stops at the door. The stairs are flanked by two windows, on of which has the perfect view of that first flight of steps (before the landing), which makes the perfect "kill-zone." Destroying the stairs is, in my case, a foolish idea.

Next to that, food has to run out some time. And unless you could board a mall up to perfection, it's not a good idea to try and hideout in a mall.

i do, however, agree with one thing you put in this paragraph: If the government does react to the situation with all the speed in the world and set up quarantine areas, millions will flock to these areas, even some carriers, and they won't let you out once you're in. The idea of major quarantines set up by the government has DEATH, DEATH, and more DEATH, written all over it.
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Mr_Jumbles
Mr_Jumbles
19. RE: Umm
Jan 2 2011, 1:41 AM EST | Post edited: Jan 2 2011, 1:41 AM EST
"Gang activity is a breeding ground for: Small arms knowledge, threat assessment, thinking under pressure, understanding a "chain of command", basic medical skills (can't go to the hospital for every little thing with a warrant) scavenging (theiving, it's only different when there's no law), some even develop effective battle tactics, mechanical skills, and improvization.
"
sorry but ... no

im sorry but none of this is true

just because you see similarities of different aspects of knowledge between groups doesnt mean that both groups grasp wtf they are even doing

doing =/= understanding
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