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Hell_raiser101	Think like a raider Feb 27 2010, 4:19 PM EST They say that the best way to beat something is to think like them, that is no different for raiders. Here is a thread to post your tactics, theories, trap ideas, or other things of the like that could benefit others. Either by giving your fellow man safety ideas for when going through unknown territory, or traps for if raiders are coming to visit. Who knows, your idea might save someones life... or maybe their idea could save yours. Post reply 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you? Keyword tags: Ideas Like Raiders Safe Tactics Think Traps
AlexHigginbotham	1. RE: Think like a raider Feb 27 2010, 4:51 PM EST Aren't they more or less pirates? Somalian version over Johnny Depp version. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Hell_raiser101	2. RE: Think like a raider Feb 27 2010, 5:06 PM EST "Aren't they more or less pirates? Somalian version over Johnny Depp version." I hope so, I'm going to be really mad if I see an octopus raider dude that can summon a giant squid. Post reply 3 out of 4 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Carnack	3. RE: Think like a raider Feb 27 2010, 5:37 PM EST Well first off traps are defensive and raiders by their very concept are not. I'd look for poison and chances of hostage-taking. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
DevilNuts	4. RE: Think like a raider Feb 28 2010, 12:57 PM EST Saying "think like a raider" is like saying "think like a survivor" -- there are bound to be many different types of raiders. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Hell_raiser101	5. RE: Think like a raider Feb 28 2010, 7:17 PM EST "Saying "think like a raider" is like saying "think like a survivor" -- there are bound to be many different types of raiders. " Agreed, its a common word I used for ease of the understanding among users of this site. Though saying it makes it any less neccesary is like telling a general/whatever the dude that leads the army is (I'm honest, I don't know anything about the military.) that he shoud not try to think like the enemy force to trap them...'Cause you know, there are going to be lots of different kinds of enemy soldiers to deal with. No matter how many different kinds of raiders there are, they still do the same task. They trap vulnrable (Bad at spelling, my apologies.) survivors, get their items by force, or if the survivors have a regenerative resource..For example, food, possibly come back for payment over and over. If they don't do that, then they really aren't any type of raider. That does give a predictible sense to raiders, and this thread is for what you said.. There are going to be many different types of raiders, I figure the different people would think like different types of raiders and give different ideas. Which could help survivors against different types of raiders... Preparing for one one type of raider makes as much sense as only preparing for shambler zombies. How do we plan for zombies? We theorise what we believe they would do, and make our ideas universal. Then, if Z-day ever comes, we would use our advance planning and theories against the zombies. Correct or incorrect? Post reply 3 out of 3 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
MajorDamage	6. RE: Think like a raider Feb 28 2010, 7:42 PM EST I give you partial credit Hell raiser101 :-) While true that one cannot plan for every single eventuality/outcome, you can still plan based upon most likely, least likely and best case scenarios. As one who has been on both sides (good/blue, red/enemy) , I can tell you that NOT planning or thinking from the enemies' point of view will result in failure. Your example of traps is notable. To counter your argument, planning would involve the most likely avenues of approach, natural obstacles and base efforts on channeling enemy to the prepared trap. Minimize (not eliminate) risk and maximize success. Post reply 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Hell_raiser101	7. RE: Think like a raider Feb 28 2010, 8:04 PM EST "I give you partial credit Hell raiser101 :-) While true that one cannot plan for every single eventuality/outcome, you can still plan based upon most likely, least likely and best case scenarios. As one who has been on both sides (good/blue, red/enemy) , I can tell you that NOT planning or thinking from the enemies' point of view will result in failure. Your example of traps is notable. To counter your argument, planning would involve the most likely avenues of approach, natural obstacles and base efforts on channeling enemy to the prepared trap. Minimize (not eliminate) risk and maximize success. " I completely agree, you have to use your surroundings to your advantage. For example, if a convoy are traveling down a road. There are trees, streams, and all that on both sides of the roads...They are not going to go through the land and risk ruining their tires, they are going to keep going down the clear looking road. That would be the perfect time to strike, because it gives the most advantage to the raiders/highwaymen/theives. To be a good leader to a combat team, you have to know when to attack, how to attack, and when to swallow your pride and let the threat by. By the way, may I ask what my arguement was? o.o I didn't know I was arguing to be honest, besides pointing out that planning is quite nessecary. Post reply 4 out of 4 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
DaLaw	8. RE: Think like a raider Mar 3 2010, 10:44 AM EST \| Post edited: Mar 3 2010, 10:48 AM EST This thread has made some very helpfull points. What Hell raiser 101 has pointed out (despite his admitted lack of military experience) is in my humble opinion militarly sound. Traps work bothways. It is probably best they should not be used to guard an avenue of escape or retreat and are indeed best placed where you suspect your enemy might approach. Raiding bands will most likely be as different as the next and even then constantly changing with the changing of the leadership. As most of these will not likely have a very established rank structure they will be led by the strongest member ala the raiders in the original Dawn of the Dead as opposed to the Postmans Holinists. It should be noted that even as structured as the Holinists were portrayed (in both the book and the movie) even they had internal strife which was settled violently. As such it would be likely that were a raiding band structured it might be more inclined to raid "renewable resources" such as a farming community with a gentler hand than it would a bunch of guys holding onto a warehouse full of perishable or expendable good such as canned food, fuel or ammo. Of course there will be exceptions to any rule. For instance even the brutish raiders in The Road Warrior resorted to negotiation in order reduce their losses as well as the loss of the fuel inside the besieged camp. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Red_Fog	9. RE: Think like a raider Mar 3 2010, 12:23 PM EST If I were the leader of a band of raiders I would do my damndest to refrain from killing instead prefering the threat of force and putting my opponent into an impossible situation. Combat is bad. Chances are you're going to take casualties, and if you're constantly fighting, you're going to run out of men far too quickly to survive as a raider group. Paraphrasing Sun Tzu, excellence is not achieved by destroying all of your enemies, exellence is achieved by forcing your enemy into surrender without ever having to fight. Also, don't ask for too much. Take only enough that you know they won't be willing to risk lives to keep it. If they refuse though, an example must be made! Still try to refrain from killing as you can't rob the dead twice. Hurt them, beat the crap out em, scar em for life. Something that let's everyone else know that there ARE consequences for messing with you. Repeating offenders may require a public execution. Keep a constant presence. Always leaving a few men around to act as your own private police force acts as a constant remind of your power over them. It also provides an opportunity to do some good deeds and help the community a bit. If you don't seem like a complete horrid monster, they may be more willing to live with and accept your presence. Eventually, you might secure yourself as their "protectors". After all, what's bad for them in the long run is also bad for you. You may even find yourself becoming the leader of a now joint community with a powerful military and enforcing arm, as well as productive, sustaining body. Anyway that's how I would try to go about it. My primary enemy would be other raiding groups trying to move in on my turf. They must be dealt with swiftly and efficiently... chu-chick Post reply 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
PedroAsani	10. RE: Think like a raider Mar 3 2010, 2:45 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 3 2010, 2:45 PM EST Red_Fog, you should talk with IrishHitman. You seem to have very similar ideas. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
AlexHigginbotham	11. RE: Think like a raider Mar 3 2010, 4:33 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 3 2010, 4:33 PM EST Man vs Man warfare in zed-poc is not going to be organized or uniformed in any way. When fighting raiders, take a tip or 2 from modern terrorists, pirates, and my favorite, the Vietcong. I would also discourage a colony to have a distinguished "uniform". I'll be rocking a couple patches but aside from that your best defense is not not allow yourself to be identified within a group. You never know, if you are under attack from a considerably large raiding party, you may be able to slip behind their lines and make them think you came with them. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
JPTank	12. RE: Think like a raider Mar 4 2010, 12:33 AM EST Wow, this is a good thread. First rule of defending from raiders: hide that $***! What I mean by that is... Say you're in a convoy. You've got a water truck and a fuel truck. Get that covered up. I take this example from my area. In certain places, if you walk out in the street with an iPod... A load of cash, and you're flashing that around- chance is you could get robbed. Someone will see that and be like "don't mind if I do". Same principle applies to your supplies. If you conceal it no one will know exactly what it is. Basically, put a good tarp over it or somthing that can hide the shape and sign that says "gas". Might as well paint a "free refills" sign too. I really like Red_Fog's point. Alot of the time it's better to surprise and subdue your opponent than to murk them outright. It comes down to strategy. Flanking tactics work well. Put pressure on one enemy flank and still have your centre in strength, while three or four of your guys sneak around the other flank which isn't guarded because the enemy is concentrating on your main force. A raiding party won't stand too long if 4 good shooters come out on their 7 o'clock and cut them in half. (very basic example). Remember, not every battle is won by outright slaughtering your enemy. It's how you slaughter them. Another strategy. (say you're in the bush). Strengthining both your flanks but leaving your centre thin works as well. Outright attack the raiders so they're thinking in the moment, their front is to your front. They feel a "weakness" in your centre and commit people to attack your centre. That's exactly what you want. Your flanks now envelope the enemy force, while your centre forces were pulling off attack and retreat manouvers. Enemy surounded, squeeze in for the kill or to make em surrender - checkmate. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Hell_raiser101	13. RE: Think like a raider Mar 4 2010, 6:42 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 4 2010, 6:42 PM EST @Red-fog It depends on what kind of raider you are. If you are dealing in an area with lots of renewable resources, yeah, don't kill them. However if you are going to be a highwayman you have to kill all of them.. Example: They do it your way and they get out of it alive, the people who now have nothing go to nearby communitys and tell them what happened along with your location. Now no one is going to go down that trapped route because they know highwaymen frequent it, they could even go with superior number and weapons to take care of the highwaymen. Either way, the raiding party loses. This is less likely for parties that are always on the move, though if it gets relayed to the wrong person, the fecal matter will hit the fan. Thats why you have to be careful as a convoy, especiouly a convoy of raiders. No one is going to like you as it is because you are a raider, and one small mistake like a guy escaping could end up killing every single one of you. @AlexHigginBotham True, though your snipers could get confused and make your head go splat. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
Red_Fog	14. RE: Think like a raider Mar 4 2010, 9:19 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 4 2010, 9:19 PM EST " @Red-fog It depends on what kind of raider you are. If you are dealing in an area with lots of renewable resources, yeah, don't kill them. However if you are going to be a highwayman you have to kill all of them.." Well glad to see people are responding to my comments. ^_^ But of course there's tons of ways to be a raider. That would just be my preferred way to go about it (if I ever was a raider) As for a smaller group living a highway man's style I'd do it different. I would still refrain from killing. Survivors go around, and tell their story, and if people here confirmation that if they surrender to you they're gonna get away unharmed they'll be more willing to hand stuff over without a fight. Also, don't take away too much. Make sure they still got enough to make it to the closest town, camp, or what ever. If robbing a larger caravan that'll be more likely to defend it's self try to demand a smaller "tax" for using "your" road. If they don't have to give away all that much they'll more likely decide to just give in rather than risk open combat. Your group will want to stay mobile, never sleep in the same spot two nights in a row. That way if a group of people ever decides to try and find and confront you you'll be considerably harder to track. Besides, if your not going around killing people or doing THAT much damage, fewer people are going to be willing to take the time and chance to find you. If you prove to be elusive, it discourages people even more. You get to greedy and cocky, the hammer will come down hard a lot sooner and you will end up dead very soon. Once again, just my way of going about it if I HAD to live as a raider. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
AlexHigginbotham	15. RE: Think like a raider Mar 5 2010, 2:47 AM EST \| Post edited: Mar 5 2010, 2:49 AM EST "@AlexHigginBotham True, though your snipers could get confused and make your head go splat" If we do have designated "snipers", they won't be standing on the top of a tower watching the event go down. The whole point of a defensive "sniper" is to be AWAY FROM THE POPULATION in a remote and concealed area where they can over watch the compound, as well as areas beyond the sight of the compound. "Snipers" will: A: Observe everything that goes on, including people sneaking out the back while designating friendlies and hostiles. B: Probably not open fire in a situation where they are greatly outnumbered. They will most likely wait for a fire fight to start so they go unnoticed. C: If they do open fire, their shots will be selective. First priority targets will consists of who is the biggest threat to their compound, IE, people dishing out the most fire power OR an obvious designated leader. If someone who isn't proficient in the art of war fighting is on over watch (a "sniper"), they will most likely take the first shot, and get killed soon after. In the event where both sides are roughly evenly matched, or the enemy force is slightly less, the over watch might take down whoever is instigating the hostility while that person's peers watch, instantly causing fear and lowering morale. For the record, I hate the term "sniper". A combination of movies and video games have completely prevented the public from knowing what a "sniper" actually does. I'm referring to them as over watch now. Post reply 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Red_Fog	16. RE: Think like a raider Mar 5 2010, 10:32 AM EST "For the record, I hate the term "sniper". A combination of movies and video games have completely prevented the public from knowing what a "sniper" actually does. I'm referring to them as over watch now." Here, here! When most people think sniper they're thinking more of a "Designated Marksman's" role than an actual sniper, but that's getting off topic so... yeah. Just agree with ya there Alex. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
AlexHigginbotham	17. RE: Think like a raider Mar 5 2010, 8:08 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 5 2010, 8:08 PM EST I have 2 close friends who are proper snipers (notice I didnt put it in quotations). They said its about the most boring thing they could have done. The movie Jarhead is kind of a good way to get the idea of what a sniper does, minus all the moaning and crying. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
Hell_raiser101	18. RE: Think like a raider Mar 5 2010, 9:27 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 5 2010, 9:27 PM EST @ Red_fog Yeah, possibly. But if the warning goes around I doubt they are going to travel through your area so they can avoid you and keep ALL their stuff. What makes you think that the caravan will give you the tax and just not shoot you all? See, a group of raiders with huge guns, huge trucks, and all that may be able to get a tax out of fright. A smaller group of highwaymen, not so much. If no one makes it out alive, how are people going to even know you exist to track you? Z-day is going to be tough, the zombies could of got them. Its not going to be too uncommon for someone to leave and not return If you are a huge group of traveling raiders, leaving them alive is not that bad. Nor is it a bad idea if they have renewable resources.. However if you are highwaymen that make a living trapping and stealing stuff from folks in certain areas (Rivers, bridges, roads, stuff like that.) then it is going to have a negative effect if they get back and tell others what happened. Because they won't go through that area, and them not going through that area is bad for "buisness". Its also easier to track you down and kill you if you are a highwaymen, for example, go read the outcome of IrishHitman and timberrattlers debate about if traveling raiders or highwaymen would win in combat. The highwaymen lost because the surviving raiders tracked them down and raided their base/camp thing. That would of all been avoided if none of them had survived.. I guess it boils down to Highwaymen: Kill unless they posess renewable resources. Raiders: Do not kill unless you have to. @ The sniper topic. What is the difference between a marksman and proper sniper? Post reply Do you find this valuable?
AlexHigginbotham	19. RE: Think like a raider Mar 5 2010, 9:46 PM EST \| Post edited: Mar 5 2010, 9:55 PM EST "@ The sniper topic. What is the difference between a marksman and proper sniper?" Edit: My whole explanation sucked. Here's the wikipedia link for both. Designated Marksman: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Designated_marksman Sniper: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sniper Post reply Do you find this valuable?

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