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hoping4cash
very good armor
Jul 19 2011, 7:55 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 19 2011, 7:55 PM EDT
i was thinking every one has good i deas but i think i have com up with a very good soultion my self a motorcycle jacket with the padding even though its good by it self there are still vunerbale areas such as the back of arms inside fore arms neck area and sides of torso. every where there is a gap cut open the jacket and use small 1x1 peices of sheet metal attachet with some sort of stong material such as wire or srtips of leather then attach to inside of jacket where needed and close up. this will add no more than 3 pounds to total weight there venteated light weight tear resistent fire resetint water (blood) resetent and you still matain amazig flexablitity 0  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
Toasterr
Toasterr
1. RE: very good armor
Jul 19 2011, 8:33 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 19 2011, 8:33 PM EDT
"i was thinking every one has good i deas but i think i have com up with a very good soultion my self a motorcycle jacket with the padding even though its good by it self there are still vunerbale areas such as the back of arms inside fore arms neck area and sides of torso. every where there is a gap cut open the jacket and use small 1x1 peices of sheet metal attachet with some sort of stong material such as wire or srtips of leather then attach to inside of jacket where needed and close up. this will add no more than 3 pounds to total weight there venteated light weight tear resistent fire resetint water (blood) resetent and you still matain amazig flexablitity"
seems to me that sewing sheet metal onto the inside of your jacket is a good way to get yourself injured
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Acroman
Acroman
2. RE: very good armor
Jul 19 2011, 8:37 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 19 2011, 8:37 PM EDT
Tear resistant? sounds more like tear-prone. sewing SHARP metal into a jacket is a good way to hurt yourself (see above) and a good way to weaken leather Do you find this valuable?    
VagabondVance
VagabondVance
3. RE: very good armor
Jul 19 2011, 10:08 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 19 2011, 10:09 PM EDT
It sounds like a horrible idea, you do know how hot those jackets get because they don't breathe and they need the slipstream of you riding a motorcycle to keep you cool right? Then you want to butt on some **** metal?

If you doubt me wear that deathtrap and run for a few miles.
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alcon-fay
alcon-fay
4. RE: very good armor
Jul 24 2011, 6:15 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 24 2011, 6:15 PM EDT
Try a leather jacket,skinny jeans, and a motorcycle helmet. There all bit proof 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
StangDemon
StangDemon
5. RE: very good armor
Jul 24 2011, 9:46 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 24 2011, 9:46 PM EDT
well i wouldnt choose a leather one, they make nice ones that can sort of breathe, but are like polyester and other stuff. i would personally rather just be quick, quiet, and agile, which the motorcycle jacket weakens at least 2 of 3 aspects. Do you find this valuable?    
oldannyboy37
oldannyboy37
6. RE: very good armor
Jul 25 2011, 2:04 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 25 2011, 2:04 AM EDT
I own a motorcycle jacket I wear every winter when it gets insanely cold. I can tell you that a jacket that would be thick enough to be bite resistant would be very uncomfortable in anything but really cold weather. Thick leather isn't exactly known for being the most flexible material either.
Leather is one of the least breathable fabrics you can wear as well. If you do a bit of work you're going to sweat like crazy.
Sewing stuff like that into your jacket would probably just weigh you down and cut you up.

If you're really worried about being bit I'd just wear some BDUs and invest in quality bite gaiters or leather covers for your lover arms.
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HandyAndy(IL)
HandyAndy(IL)
7. RE: very good armor
Feb 1 2012, 12:45 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 1 2012, 12:45 PM EST
ya i would stay away from the metal but leather strips on a denim jacket would be the way i would go. and if u can use brads or rivets to attach them for a tighter hold. 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
mars22581
mars22581
8. RE: very good armor
Feb 1 2012, 9:38 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 1 2012, 9:38 PM EST
They make Kevlar guards that go on your arms and head (mostly for industrial work) but you can get them online from a lot of places. Google 'Kevlar sleeves' and 'Kevlar balaclava'

Another idea I read, was using steel washers as a type of 'macro' chain mail.

Not making any claims about the effectiveness of either though.
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Zee-Man
Zee-Man
9. RE: very good armor
Feb 1 2012, 10:33 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 1 2012, 10:33 PM EST
What you describe hoping (and mars with the washers), is called brigandine, albeit less elaborate than medieval style.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brigandine

brigandine is a sub-set of Banded Mail

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banded_mail

To overcome the tear problem, use a file to filet or round the corners. all edges should eiter be hemmed or at least rounded by sanding with a fine grit.

All mail is heavy, so if you plan on using it you need to train into it some. Padding is an essential part of medieval style armors if you expect to go hand to hand with raiders in it.

Now, if all I was doing was trying to prevent bites, the leather is already most of the way there. Try going with vinyl from siding instead of sheet metal. Cut with scissors and off you go.

I plan on this as an experiment later this year, if you do it first Ill be happy to hear the results.

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White76Knight
White76Knight
10. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 12:49 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 12:49 AM EST
"Try a leather jacket, skinny jeans, and a motorcycle helmet. They're all bite proof"
Of the three the only one I would consider bite proof is the helmet. The jeans and leather jacket, while they may protect you some, wouldn't stop a determined bite.

As I mentioned in another thread, I have personally been bitten hard enough to draw blood through a heavy denim jacket, and that was by a seven year old girl. Her teeth didn't bite through the material, but the force of her teeth crushing through that material was sufficient to break the skin anyway, and had she been a zombie my blood soaking through and mingling with her saliva would have been enough to present a vector for infection.

Now if we assume that a zombie will be able to bite at least as hard as a seven year old, and that's probably a pretty safe assumption, then I wouldn't trust either denim jeans or a leather jacket to protect me. That's why my armor of choice would be head to toe hooded chain maille coveralls, sort of like a shark suit. No human teeth will ever bite through maille, and the padded garment worn underneath (called a gambeson in medieval terms) will prevent the sort of crushing force bite that I mentioned earlier.

Properly made, such maille coveralls would be every bit as lightweight as any other form of full head to toe body coverage armor that I would actually trust to be completely bite proof. For those who are interested, such properly made maille can be had here, though it is kinda spendy:

http://www.weldedchainmail.com/index.htm

This guy makes maille in either stainless or titanium and individually welds each link closed. Given that full coveralls will probably require about 80,000 links or more, that's a helluva lot of welding and why his maille is so expensive. This allows the use of thinner links, and thus a far lighter finished maille, while increasing the strength of each link by about 20x.
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problomatic
11. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 9:47 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 9:47 AM EST
But if the teeth didn't puncture then it'd hurt...but you wouldn't be infected....+1 for a textile motorcycle suit. I'm looking to move, not get pinned down. Do you find this valuable?    
White76Knight
White76Knight
12. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 12:42 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 12:42 PM EST
"But if the teeth didn't puncture then it'd hurt...but you wouldn't be infected....+1 for a textile motorcycle suit. I'm looking to move, not get pinned down. "
Teeth don't need to puncture to break the skin. When i was bitten by the seven year old, for instance, her teeth never made it through the denim so there was no puncture per se, but the force of her teeth crushing the denim against my flesh still caused the skin to break. Now once the skin has broken, once you've drawn blood, whether there was a puncture involved or not, then it presents an open would through which saliva could enter causing infection.

As for looking to move, this is why I'd choose chain maille over some of the heavier styles of plate armors and what not. Properly made maille is lighter and less restrictive than most other armor types, particularly less so than most people might realize. I don't think that properly made maille, properly fitted to the wearer, would restrict speed or maneuverability much at all.
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HandyAndy(IL)
HandyAndy(IL)
13. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 1:55 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 1:55 PM EST
Yeah, if the skin was broken, you could be sure that there would be saliva on the material which could seep through into the wound.

i think my idea of boiled hardened leather over denim is the way i would go.
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problomatic
14. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 5:34 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 5:34 PM EST
Maille doesn't stop blunt force trauma either, and provides less protection from blood and saliva than say...a weather proof suit. And walking around in boilded hardened leather would make me feel like a walking piece of beef jerky. Leather is HEAVY and STIFF good luck moving. I was amazed at the difference in weights between my textile motorcycle jacket and a leather one. Its all about sacrafice. Sure, chainmail and heavy leather would be better protection... But at what cost. You can't wear the chainmail next to your skin, so you'd actually be wearing 2, maybe 3 layered outfits. And the leather would be so heavy and stiff as to slow restrict my movements... Plus I already have the motorcycle gear so its much easier for me to use... Since I already have it. Do you find this valuable?    
brandon_a_boyer
brandon_a_boyer
15. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 5:45 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 5:45 PM EST
"http://www.weldedchainmail.com/index.htm

This guy makes maille in either stainless or titanium and individually welds each link closed. Given that full coveralls will probably require about 80,000 links or more, that's a helluva lot of welding and why his maille is so expensive. This allows the use of thinner links, and thus a far lighter finished maille, while increasing the strength of each link by about 20x."
The funny thing is those welds look like ****.

The factor of 20 is a made up number too. Regardless, properly welded or brazed links would be substantially stronger than butted ones.
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White76Knight
White76Knight
16. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 9:37 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 9:37 PM EST
"Yeah, if the skin was broken, you could be sure that there would be saliva on the material which could seep through into the wound.

i think my idea of boiled hardened leather over denim is the way i would go. "
I agree with the boiled hardened leather, though as problomatic mentioned, full body protection might be kinda weighty. Aside from the weight it needn't be restrictive, however, as properly made leather armor would be fully articulated at the joints.

I have considered using hardened leather as reinforcement armor over the neck and shoulder area and perhaps my arms as these seem to be the most commonly bitten body parts (according to the movies anyway, for what they're worth).
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problomatic
17. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 9:40 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 9:44 PM EST
What about something like this? Its kinda how my mesh jacket is constructed.

http://www.motorhelmets.com/htm-apparel/acerbis/2012-12/acerbis-apparel-off-road-body-armor-adult-roost-deflector-cosmo.htm

Maybe not by itself, but under a decent jacket. Still gotta prtect the legs and groin. I have some padded underpants for my bike made to soak up the force of dropping your bike. But they offer no protection to the back of the legs/butt. For pure front that'd be easy to find, maybe a welder's apron and jacket. Its thick leather.
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White76Knight
White76Knight
18. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 9:47 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 9:47 PM EST
"Maille doesn't stop blunt force trauma either, and provides less protection from blood and saliva than say...a weather proof suit. And walking around in boilded hardened leather would make me feel like a walking piece of beef jerky. Leather is HEAVY and STIFF good luck moving. I was amazed at the difference in weights between my textile motorcycle jacket and a leather one. Its all about sacrafice. Sure, chainmail and heavy leather would be better protection... But at what cost. You can't wear the chainmail next to your skin, so you'd actually be wearing 2, maybe 3 layered outfits. And the leather would be so heavy and stiff as to slow restrict my movements... Plus I already have the motorcycle gear so its much easier for me to use... Since I already have it. "
You are correct, maille does almost nothing to protect against blunt force trauma, but in a zombie scenario blunt force trauma wouldn't be the kind of injury that I'd primarily be worried about. And while it won't stop saliva and other splatter, it will minimize the number of open wounds that such splatter could get into. Most weather proof suits, on the other hand, would stop the splatter but they would do bupkis to prevent bites, and would be very hot and uncomfortable to wear in warmer weather.

As I mentioned in my previous post, neither leather armor or maille need be restrictive. Either would be a little heavier than ordinary clothing, sure, but I'd gladly sacrifice that weight for the bite protection offered.

As for layered outfits, the maille suit that I envision would only require a suit of ordinary mechanics coveralls; the insulated ones that you'd probably wear in the colder months anyway would provide all the padding you'd need, whereas the uninsulated ones would do in the summertime with just a little extra padding st­itched in at the shoulders, hips, knees and elbows to prevent chafing from the maille. The rest of the coveralls would be just the normal single layer of material, as light or heavy as you deem appropriate, and should breathe just fine.
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White76Knight
White76Knight
19. RE: very good armor
Feb 2 2012, 9:52 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 2 2012, 9:52 PM EST
"The funny thing is those welds look like ****.

The factor of 20 is a made up number too. Regardless, properly welded or brazed links would be substantially stronger than butted ones."
Actually from what I understand the 20x comes from the number of pounds of force that must be applied to pull apart a welded link as compared to the number of pounds of force required to pull apart a link that is simply butted closed. That aside, I agree, whether 20x is an accurate number or not, welded or brazed links would still be better. Riveted links would do the job too, but apparently t­itanium is easier to weld than to rivet, and since t­itanium is lighter than stainless I'd go with the welded t­itanium if I could.
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